Today I'm talking with Debra at Harvest Creek Farm & Retreat.

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00:00 This is Mary Lewis at A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters. If you're enjoying this podcast, please like, subscribe, share it with a friend, or leave a comment. Thank you. Today I'm chatting with Debra at Harvest Creek Farm and Retreat. How are you, Debra? I am doing wonderful today. Thank you, Mary, for inviting me today.

00:22 Oh, you are very welcome. I need you guys to talk to me or I don't have a podcast. So thank you for being willing to come visit. Tell me about yourself and Harvest Creek Farm and Retreat. Well, we started about three years ago and my husband and I were just looking for about five acres. We live in a subdivision and I wanted to have some chickens and I wanted to grow some vegetables and fruit trees. And well, you know what HOAs are like.

00:50 We would try to find about five acres. Well, we came across this 15 acre parcel that used to be a farm decades ago. And so we slowly but surely, it had completely grown up. It was woods, forest. So over the next about a year or so, it was literally just excavation and taking down trees and just trying to get back the pasture again. It was so overgrown. And so we started working on that.

01:20 put in a little vegetable garden that first year and it did amazing. So we started growing vegetables and we had our chickens and ended up buying four or five more acres adjacent to our property. So now we have 20 acres and it is just exploded and we have now built a pavilion on it. We have a vacation cottage that people love to come and stay and we've left, we left quite a few woods and put the cottage near that.

01:50 So people have a place to just come and relax and get away from city life. Yet we're only minutes from the main city of Lenoir City. So it's just been an incredible project. As all farmers know, it is tireless. You never get caught up. And so we've had help here and there that we've hired. But basically my husband, myself, and some friends really have been helping us here and there. But now we are officially

02:19 A You Pick Flower Farm. Nice. Okay. So, you're in Tennessee and how many years ago was this that you started it, that you bought it? Three years ago. Okay. Yeah. All right. Awesome. I want to talk about the flower farm for sure. Yeah. But I also want to talk about the work involved. Did you get your chickens?

02:44 So yes, we had chickens for, I think it was about 18 months and we started doing a lot of traveling. We've actually joined the Tennessee Agri-Tourism Association. Oh yeah. Yeah, we've been going to those conferences and getting more involved in that. So as you know, you just can't leave animals. No. It just got to a point where the chickens were not going to be our focus. So we were able to have them adopted by some friends. And so they're happy. They did not get beheaded.

03:13 Good. Yes. And so now we do not have any animals on the farm. Eventually, we'd love to get some horses. I actually lived in a farm in Australia on a stud ranch for some time. And so that's always in my heart. So eventually we'll get horses. But right now we're focusing on the flowers. Okay. You lived in Australia on a what ranch? A stud farm, a stud ranch. Stud, stud ranch. All I heard was said. And I'm like, I don't know what that is. Sorry.

03:43 Okay, Stud Ranch, that makes more sense, thank you. Okay, so you have the flower farm. Do you do events around the flowers? Do you sell the flowers? What's involved in the flower part of the business? So we actually ended up putting a farm store at the bottom of our property to sell our vegetables and to sell our flowers, which has now become this beautiful little boutique farm store that we carry honey, not from our own property, that we purchase honey from.

04:13 and we have flowers, other flowers and gifts and candles and soaps and things like that and wind chimes and garden theme that people love to just stop by. We just started that last month and so now they will come to the farm store and they will sign up for their you pick time and then they'll go out and they'll start picking flowers. So yes we have a pavilion and because we're part of the

04:40 We have a minimum 15 acres and we're part of the agritourism association. We can have events under, under that. So we will eventually do weddings and have lots of other fun events here. Awesome. I just, I just chatted a week or so ago with a lady who lives a couple of towns up from me and she has a flower place too. It's freedom, freedom, forge flower farm or something like that.

05:09 And she does events. She's got three planned this summer. And it sounded like so much fun. But I'm not so big on the pollinators that go with the flowers. I mean, I love them. They do their job. They're important. But I don't really want to be walking through the flowers and get popped by a bee. So not really my thing to go to. However, I love

05:34 I love, love, love flowers. I mean, when we moved here four years ago, the first thing we did was get peony roots in and tulip bulbs in and daffodil bulbs in because there was nothing here. The only flowers here were hostas. And hostas don't count for me as a flower because they're not my favorite and they love shade. And the only place to grow them was on the backside of our house, which is where the only door in and out of the house is.

06:04 So everything else, which is grasses and wildflowers, there was no anything here for cutting flowers, as it were. You've really transformed your place. We have, oh my goodness. Isn't it? It's a lot. It's a lot of planning. It's a lot of thinking through. It's a lot of knowing, or if you don't know, learning, what will grow where. Yes, trial and error all the way.

06:34 What I have never in my life had more appreciation for farmers. The dependence on the weather, the dependence on what kind of pests are going to come that particular season. Some seasons are stronger than others. What do I use this year? It's like you finally see your apple trees coming in and these beautiful sweet apples and then you go out the next day and they're all gone. That happened to us last year. We still don't know what happened. There was not.

07:02 even one on the ground. They were gone. Do you have deer in your area? Yes, there are a few deer, but they were in a location. There's no way they could have reached the top of those trees. They're tall. So quite interesting, but you don't know. You just have to go with the flow and the breaks come sometimes and sometimes the difficult challenges arise and you just ride through them.

07:30 because there's going to be a sweet season coming. Yes, and you have to either laugh or cry and either one is perfectly acceptable. Exactly. We had a whole bunch of lovely apple blooms this spring. There is not a single baby apple on any of our trees because we had a huge windstorm when the trees bloomed and they took the flowers, gone. Nothing to pollinate. Devastating, isn't it? It's...

07:59 It's my dad, my dad would say it's such a pissa because he's from New England and it really is. It's such a disappointment. Yes. But there's always next year and we had some apples last year so we actually got to try them. They were fantastic. So there's always another season coming and that's, I think that's what all of us who grow produce rely on. Definitely. Yeah. It's not the easiest thing on earth.

08:27 It's also not the hardest thing on earth either. Right. Right. And I think that's why we really chose flowers, too, because we because we have so much land here. We ended up doing a flower trail. And so people can go to different zones over it throughout the farm. And so they can just go for a hike, basically, and pick flowers. While they're hiking, we did not concentrate all our flowers in one garden. We spread them.

08:55 over the entire 20 acres on trails. And fortunately, we've had plenty of sun in each of those locations. And we've measured and we're almost a mile of zinnias. Wow. It's pretty incredible. I think we can probably take the Guinness World Book of Records on that one. I think that's a lot of zinnias. Do you guys have a drone? Do you have any way to take aerial footage of your gardens?

09:22 Thank you for that reminder. We do have a friend that does that. And yes, yes, yes, they're in full bloom right now. We totally need to do that. Thank you, Mary. Yes, do that, because I want to see them. I ask because I'm selfish. I want to see this. And then the other question I have for you is since you grow flowers and you clearly love growing flowers and you know how much happiness flowers bring to people, I'm not. If you don't do this, I'm not telling you you have to, but something to consider.

09:52 Do you donate flowers to, I don't know, hospitals for patients or to nursing homes or any of that? This is our first year and they just came to the Zoom two weeks ago. So that is a fabulous idea. Yes, I will definitely look into that. I love that. Yeah, I, they're okay. Where we used to live before we moved here, there was an

10:18 what they wouldn't have called 100 years ago or 80 years ago an old folks home. And now it's called assisted living or whatever for folks who are older and need some help. And they would get bouquets from the local florists, just extra flowers that the florists weren't going to use. And they would give them to the people who live there to have in their rooms. What a beauty. It just spurs things up.

10:48 I was like, she's grown a lot of flowers. I wonder. I think I have a new assignment now. Definitely. Wonderful idea. Yeah. And I mean, man, if I was 85 years old and could not really get out in nature, I would be thrilled to have a bouquet of flowers brought to my room. That would make me really happy. Yeah. I'm not there yet, so we're good. Right. Yeah. Good job for that. Well, we actually have a lady that lives just kind of in our property when we bought the

11:17 We bought it from her and she really didn't want to move. So we sectioned off a half an acre for her so she could stay. And so 81 years old. And so every time I do the bouquets, because I also do wedding bouquets, just did my daughter's wedding. So I took her one of the bouquets and you're right. At that age, it means the world to them. Yeah, super cool that she got to stay. That's amazing. Yeah, yeah, worked out great. Awesome.

11:47 Okay, so what kind of flowers you grow besides zinnias? Because I love every flower I've ever met. Right, we have astur and then we also have some dahlias in and then I have two huge sunflower fields. Okay and is that all? Is that all you grow? So in the fall I will get my ranoculus and my peonies and my anemones in. So that's here. You know it's always in stages.

12:17 Usually I'm not failing. So we're gonna get really good at this before we start adding anything else Okay, you mentioned my absolute favorite flower on earth peonies. Have you grown them before? Well, my mother grew them. So I'm originally from Canada and she had a garden she had she did roses and What else did she have? But just flip my mind Azaleas and Rhododendrons and

12:46 She did peonies. She had quite a few in her garden. The weather up there was better, so I'm not sure how peonies will do in the South yet. Yeah, I was going to say, I have been growing peonies in my yard one way or another for about 20 years. And the things that I can tell you about peonies, if you would like to know, is the first year, the first spring after you plant the roots, or rhizomes or whatever they are.

13:16 They won't really do anything. They will just, they will grow. They will have the green leaves and everything, but they probably will not bloom. Second year, second spring, you might get a couple blooms. Third year is when they do really well because they've gotten themselves established. Ah, good to know. Yep, and the thing that people have always told me is the first year is sleep, second year is creep, third year is leap. Isn't that the truth? Yeah, I see it.

13:43 trees all the time when we've bought those emerald green trees, you know, yeah. Sometimes you're thinking, what's going on? They're not growing. And then boom, three years later. But it's such a reminder that farming is patience. It sure is. Oh, you just, the reward is down the road. But patience and yeah, giving God all the way through it is, there's a result at the end. Yep.

14:10 And then the other question I have is how cold does it get in the winter time for you in Tennessee? We had, we've had a couple of rough winters. It has gone down to occasionally eight degrees, which is quite rare for here. It's not, it doesn't usually do that. It usually sits around, you know, 32 degrees, sometimes 28 in the winter in January or so. So it doesn't get biting cold, but the past two years have definitely changed. It's gotten

14:39 and we've lost a lot of plants because of that. And also, as you mentioned with your apple tree, all the blooms, the wind came along and blew them away. We had last year, all our fruit trees were blooming and we had a late, very late cold snap and it killed all the blooms. Yep, I hate that. Yeah. Okay, the reason I asked how cold it gets is because the peonies need time to sleep in the wintertime and they needed to be chilly.

15:09 So as long as it gets to the freezing mark or slightly below, you might have some good luck with peonies. I don't know. Okay. I will not plant a whole field then. I will plant a small garden of them. Thank you. Bye. Yeah. I would hate for you to go out and spend hundreds of dollars on the stock and then have them not do well. That would be terrible. Have you done any ranunculus? I have not. I don't even know what it looks like.

15:38 They're like a little mini rose almost, puffy. They're beautiful, but they're fragile. So I'm a little hesitant, but I'm going to give them a try. Well, you can start small with that too and see what happens. Exactly. We put in, we tried two springs ago, three springs ago. I can't remember now. We wanted to try growing the crocus that puts out the saffron. Oh, I've not heard of that.

16:07 because I read that you could grow it in Minnesota. Well, you might be able to grow it in Minnesota, but I think that the voles, the little rodents, ate the bulbs, because we didn't get any crocuses in there. But we got the regular crocuses. Oh my goodness. And we only bought like 12 bulbs, because I was like, I don't want to spend a whole lot of money on these, not knowing how they're going to do. And really glad we didn't spend hundreds of dollars on the...

16:36 the saffron crocus producing thingies because it would have been a really bad situation. So sometimes you try and sometimes it doesn't work and sometimes you try and it turns out great. Yeah, exactly. And it's quite shocking. We get excited in the spring or kind of in the winter when you know spring's on its way and you can't stop. You start buying all these seeds and bulbs and it's like we've spent.

17:01 thousands of dollars here. You know, because it's exciting and it's fun to buy all that kind of stuff. But boy, you've got to really watch your budget or it can be crazy. Yes, you will go broke trying to grow beautiful things. Yes. We haven't gone broke yet, but we've thought about going broke buying beautiful things. So, okay, so how hot does it get in Tennessee in the summertime?

17:29 We are in the nineties this week and coming week it's forecasted for 95. So the average has been over the years. It's between 85 and 90 throughout the summer. It's definitely way higher this year. We've not experienced nineties like this in June. It's unusual. So, and I'm just hearing that all across the country, different people that I speak to different regions, they're all have new challenges and just

17:57 unusual weather patterns. So you just don't know. Next week it could be in the 70s. Yeah, this weather has been absolute insanity. We got a foot of snow for the entire winter where I live and we usually get three or four feet. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Yeah. And then this last two weeks we've had nothing but rain. Yesterday was the first day in eight days where it was sunny and

18:27 Oh my goodness. And that is a very unusual pattern, isn't it? Yeah, that doesn't, that's not, that usually happens like at the end of April into May here. And today's June, what, 24th, 25th? Yeah. Yeah. So, no, this is, it's nutty and I don't love it. And I'm, okay, I've said this a billion times. I'm going to say it again. We grow a farm to market garden here. And,

18:56 for the last three springs. By now, we've had lettuces to sell, we've had spinach and chard and kale. We have nothing to sell right now because we got stuff in and then it just rained. And everything in the garden right now is just stalled out. It's still alive, it's still growing, but it's just really, really slow. And it just reminds you, you can't promise people and customers anything with these. No.

19:25 friends right now. And you say that you grew lettuce. I don't know why I have been so challenged with lettuce. I grow it. It's gorgeous. I pick it and it's bitter. What am I doing? I'll tell you exactly why. If you've had really hot days, lettuce gets bitter if it's too hot out. Oh my gosh. Okay. So there's no doubt that like, I guess just a greenhouse is the only way. Yep. Okay. Yep.

19:54 I won't eat lettuce out of our garden past the end of June because it's just too hot. And it does. It gets that real icky, bitter taste to it. And it looks wonderful. It looks like the most delicious lettuce ever known to man, but you bite into it and you're like, this is awful. It's too hot. That's what it is. All right. Thank you so much for that. Yep.

20:18 Lettuce likes it to be warm during the day and cool at night. It's more of a cold weather crop than a hot middle of the summer crop. So similar to spinach, I guess. Yep. Yeah. Okay. Yep. And kale doesn't matter because honest to God, nobody actually loves kale. No, right? Yes. I'm sure there are people who do, but most of the people I've talked to are like, eh, kale's something, yeah.

20:44 You throw in the pan and wilt to go with your stir fry, because then it tastes like everything else. Yeah, I see. And I am not actually the gardener in my household. My husband is. But I used to garden with him. I just don't love it enough to keep doing it. But he is an avid gardener. So when people bring things up like that, I know the answers. But it's not because I'm still doing the gardening.

21:13 Right. Well, you're doing what you love. And I think it's wonderful you're doing these podcasts. I was able to go in and listen to some of the past ones and I was learning some stuff that other people are sharing and they tried this and that didn't work and then they tried this and that's just, yeah, it's great. Thank you for doing these podcasts. Oh, you are absolutely welcome. I just needed something to do that I was interested in. So it's no skin off my brow to do these.

21:43 I was going to say, because I'm nuts, I am absolutely crazy. I have started another podcast with a friend of mine who is a master gardener in Minnesota. And that one has three episodes out. It's called Mary and the Master Gardener. And I'm not the master gardener. She is. Her name is Liz. So if you want to learn things about gardening, it's not necessarily just gardening in Minnesota. It's gardening wherever. That's wonderful.

22:12 So I can send you the link if you want it later. But it's fun, and we're doing two more episodes on Wednesday to be released on Friday. One's going to be about herbs, and one's going to be about composting. Oh, definitely in on that. We do have quite a big herb garden, too, and we're selling those as you pick. Mm-hmm.

22:34 I love herbs. I love going and picking out herb seedlings. I love growing the babies on my kitchen table in March. I love being able to go cut fresh basil for bruschetta or the stuff you put on pasta. Garlic and basil and olive oil. Pesto? Yes, that. Thank you.

23:01 Yes. I was like, I know the word. Where is it? We have to find some pine nuts, Mary. Oh, that too. Yes. Yes. And oh my goodness, pine nuts are so expensive right now. They are. Yeah. Oh. Yeah. I'm going to have to figure out how to do my own. I'm going to have to find a pine tree and harvest my own pine nuts because this is not okay. Fascinating how they do come from that. I want to learn.

23:27 You can never stop learning, can you? Like, I mean, literally there is so much that we can learn from others and from podcasts and books and YouTube, and you never stop learning. There's so much. I think that my brain would explode if all the gardening things I've ever wanted to know were in it. Yes, so true. Well then, like, I've got to ask the gardeners. And I gotta.

23:51 I gotta warn Liz not to tell me everything or my head will explode because she's brilliant. She knows so much about gardening. I know maybe an eighth of what she knows. Maybe. Right. So, but either way, how are your flowers doing? I mean, when did you get stuff in this year? We got them in the last week of April. This week they exploded.

24:20 So we have, so we're open this Friday for you to pick. There are millions. I mean, I'm not being dramatic. There are so many flowers and they're so beautiful. And the bugs thankfully have not harmed any of the flowers. We were praying for rain. You could see the bottom of the leaves because we've planted so many. They were starting to dry out because we've been in the nineties with no rain. Yeah.

24:49 the rain came and it was a soaking rain and it was just what we needed. And I put on Facebook, thank you Lord for the rain last night. And all these people were liking it. So a lot of the farmers in the area was just like, Oh, everything is so thirsty. So they are doing now that they've also had that drink of water. They are stunning. We do have a lot of photos on Facebook and on our website. Nice. Yeah. Um, as I was telling you, before we started recording, it's been doing nothing but rain here.

25:19 So I would love to just like send you bucket fulls of water from the state of Minnesota because we don't need anymore. And I'm sure just like suddenly your weather is going to change again. Yep. Yeah. Yeah, I figure we'll be back in a drought by August, but right now we are nowhere near a drought. Right. Wow. Amazing. And it's so everything that we growers do is dependent on what falls out of the sky or what

25:49 doesn't. Back in April, we were in a drought and had been since last year. And we'd get a little bit of rain and everybody's like, oh, thank God it rained and we need the rain. And then basically the whole month of, well, the end of the month of May and almost all of June, we have gotten rain almost every day. Oh my gosh. That is just a drastic change.

26:16 Mm-hmm. Yeah, and it's just it's not great. It's If you're in a drought and you have a well you can water your plants If you're not in a drought if you're in the exact opposite of a drought You can't suck the water back out of the ground. Mm-hmm So I would almost rather be in a drought and be able to water what needs to be watered Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah, it's it's like in the wintertime in the wintertime if it's too cold

26:45 you can throw on 7,000 layers of clothes and be warm. In the summertime, if it's too hot, you can't be any more naked than naked. It's the same situation. You're right. So it's been incredibly frustrating. My husband has been getting more and more frustrated as it's rained more and more. Yeah. And I looked at him the other day. I said, are you OK? And he's like,

27:14 I'm letting it go. He said, I am, he said, I have been so frustrated with this. He said, I'm letting it go. We have the greenhouse. We have lots of stuff growing in the greenhouse because it's not soaked. Right. He said, as soon as this weather breaks, I will be able to get all that stuff that's been growing into the actual garden and it will do fine. I said, well, look at you being a grownup. He's like, I can't fight the weather. I know.

27:39 And it's so interesting because my husband, Randy, he's been like completely the opposite with the weather. It's been a drought here for a while. And so we bought a huge tank. Well, he bought it and put it on the back of his side by side. He drives around with a hose watering almost a mile of flowers. And of course, 40 gallons doesn't go very far. 100 gallons, maybe it is. And so he's back filling it up again. He's like, oh, I need this rain. God love that man. Yeah.

28:09 Yeah, and that's for my flowers. So sweet, you know, you can just, oh, well, honey, I guess you're croc died. But no, no. He faithfully helps me through all of it. It's it's a joint effort. It takes both of us for sure. He loves you. There's no question in my mind. He loves you. Yes, I do know that. It's a wonderful thing. Yes. All right, ma'am, I'm gonna I'm gonna wrap this up because we're almost at 30 minutes.

28:37 I really appreciate you taking the time to talk with me and I hope that your you pick goes really, really well. Thank you so much. I love this time sharing with you today. I loved talking with you about flowers. Yeah. All right. Have a great day, Debra. Thanks. You too, Mary.